The Poor School

No i get that just thought should clarify a bit.

oh and that should read 'was NOT intending to offend above'!

• 17 years ago
• 21

Blimey! I seemed to have opened a can of worms here!

Thanks Barbara for your comments. I do agree with you in the fact that I have worked with some actors who have had professional training, but are not necessarily as good as those who haven't gone through the more traditional route. Certainly I do need training, as I'm not quite up to the world's best actor, just yet!!

As for the anonymous man/woman (why are you anonymous?), I do understand your point, which I thought I'd said earlier. The reason I have mentioned that I have amateur dramatics experience on my profile, is because if anyone just saw my professional work then they wouldn't have realised that I have done a lot of theatre work in my time (including performing in The National Theatre). I agree, amateur work isn't by any means professional, but it is experience, whichever way you want to look at it.

I agree that just by deciding to give acting a shot, I shouldn't refer to myself as a professional actress, and in fact, I don't. However, I have to start somewhere. And this posting was all about whether or not to do some training in a well known drama school, so I am not just thinking I can walk out of my day job and become an actress overnight. I'm not sure whether your anger is directed at me or in general people like me who have had a different career and decided to change it. I have always wanted to go into acting, it's been my first choice since I was a kid. However, because it's so difficult to get into, I decided to pursue another career first so that I had something to fall back on if things don't work out.

Yes, there are lot of wannabes out there with Big Brother etc all just wanting to be famous. I'm not looking for fame, I just want to act in Theatre. I apologise for offending you, or those like you, who quite rightly have worked hard at drama school and are struggling to find work now, only to have people who haven't been to drama school try and muscle in, and yes, I understand the parallel you were making. I do not overstate my experience on my CV as I don't want to make a pratt of myself at an audition where I would be completely out of my depth, let alone annoy the casting directors!

As Mark says, I have learnt at every audition I've gone to, whether I've got the job or not. It's a steep learning curve, and one that I'm having to learn fast due to the nature of the business.

The reason for starting this thread was to ask about summer school, and now about The Actors Company, so surely that's training and in your eyes, I'm going down the right route???

• 17 years ago
• 22

I'm not trying to have a go at you sue, to the contrary i've think i've stated that you'd do yourself a disservice by going on three-week courses which casting directors etc don't rate rather than ayear course which they would more likely pay attention to. Yes i understand you have at yet done very little but can you understand that by placing amateur dramatics on your cv that is how you come across, as amateur. In my opinion it would be better to leave it completely off. You obviously have the opportunity through this site and through other sites such as talent-circle, mandy.com etc to slowly build up that cv and as time goes by i'm sure each piece and auidtion will get better and better, that is the process and you seem to want to subscribe to it. Therefore i don't know why you would place yourself at a disadvantage to everyone else on this site, some who may be no more talented than you or who may have less experience than you but who all class themsleves as professional, by being the sole person using their amateur work as experience. I really don't think CD's etc will care.

I do though wish you luck and would recommend browsing other profiles to see how people have presented themselves. The trick is to promotoe your qualities and poistive points rather than the negative without actually lying.

• 17 years ago
• 23

I can see 'anon's' point (and why are you anon? if you're really adament and believe in what you're saying why are you hiding?)I think you're being a bit of a snob. Whilst training probably is the ideal route into this industry, it certainly isn't the only route. Many of our finest actors didn't actually go to drama school. It is possible to learn on the job, that's how rep companies always worked. If you're talented, hard working and realistic there's no reason why you should be considered not worthy of being taken seriously just because you didn't train for 3 years. Where did you train Anon? Do you think it's afforded more work than if you hadn't trained? As you're posting anon I can't peruse your CV!

Drama School's are not necessarily the best way to go now anyway, many of them still only train you for theatre rather than film/TV/radio as well, and they are extremely expensive. Any form of learning is valid. The bottom line is you can either act or you can't, yes talent needs to be fine tuned, but the part will go to the actor who gives the best performance, not because of where they trained.

My tuppence worth!
Lucy

• 17 years ago
• 24

Lucy, you go girl! ;-)

Have a fab weekend every! xx

• 17 years ago
• 25

Well said, Lucy. I totally agree with you on all your points.

As I think I said on my message about Anonymous Postings, would I listen to anything you had to say if you met me in a bar with a bag on your head? Why should I listen to you here whilst you hide behind this anonymous mask?

Some of what you're saying is valid but, I'm afraid, your insistence on remaining anonymous waters down your arguement quite considerably.

• 17 years ago
• 26

I meant everyone and this time i really am going. Honest!
x

• 17 years ago
• 27

hi sue - if you've already been professionally cast then you've achieved something that many drama school graduates never do, so you're obviously doing something right. I did the whole drama school thing years ago and, to be perfectly honest, I didn't think that much of the training, although I did have a marvellous time. I'd advise doing short courses in things that really interest you rather than some generic "drama training". And once you've got a couple of jobs on your cv then casting directors won't care if you trained or not. If there are amateur credits on your cv then I'd get rid of them as soon as possible - there is still a stigma attached to amateur dramatics in the business (rightly or wrongly). Only have things on your cv that you wouldn't be embarrassed to talk about.
all the best,
cliff

• 17 years ago
• 28

Okay, okay!

Firstly i am anonymous because i'm associated with certain companies who, though many i know have expressed the same personal sentiments as me here, may not want the company to express that as a professional point of you. If you think that dilutes my argument or that means you won't read what i write, that's fine. It is a discussion board, I only give my honest opinion and am more than happy for people to agree or disagree. However anonymous or not i believe my opinions are valid.

In response to tha claims of snobbery, I think i've stated very clearly that there are many great actors who never trained and that i don't think the drama school route is the only option. the original question was in response to the three week course. Many have already stated that most casting directors and agents would only rate these kind of courses as additional training rather than as full training and therefore may be worthless if your intention is simply to attract that kind of interest. I maintain that the best course available, if Sue were in a position to seek out such a course, would be a post-grad as they are recognised courses and can provide a wonderful source of training to people, like Sue, who have followed their dream later in life. Again i would say though, some training is better than none as it shows an indication to learn.

I would just like to point out that i have done castings and worked for an agent in the past and one thing i would say is that someone with little or no training but with obvious talent and hunger would always catch my eye, given the chance, over drama graduates going through the motions. Simple. However, chances of an agent or casting people vieweing you if you mention amateur work on your cv is greatly reduced the older you are and for anyone to imagine otherwise is slightly deluded. Young people usually can get away with being spotted as its raw talent than people hone in on. With so many people already trained why would i be interested in someone older? It's not the notion of Sue gaining work etc that has frustrated me, it hasn't and good luck to her, its the starting block which she is using which i think is seriously flawed(If we all placed our fave amateur roles than our cv's would all be pages long.) You see it regularly where people draw attention to an area they feel they may be lacking in a sort of apologetic manner before you've even see them. Again i say highlight you're positive points and play to your strengths. In Sue's case her obvious desire to act, the fact she's had life experience outside the theatre world, which to me is always interesting, and her willingness to learn, which is evident. Change the manner in which you view yourself so that you can utilise these positive aspects because at a casting i don't want to see negative or apologetic.

As for untrained people 'taking our jobs' as someone posted. I'm afraid i don't buy that either. As a professional actor all i can do is be as prepared as possible for every opportunity. I must assume that if i've been called in i stand a chance but am aware, as i'm a certain type, that not every role is right for me. Just this week i had two great feedbacks where the end line was, but you're much taller than the girl we cast so....It happens. I also see quite a few similar people auditioning but to worry about what they do or think of them in a dangerously competetive way rather than focusing on the job i have to do is, to me counterproductive. Likewise who knows what pre-determined image a casting director or director has in mind for a part. You either fit it or you don't and if you don't you better be bloody good to make them rethink. Therefore whether the 'competition' is trained or untrained matters not one bit as it is not something i have control over.

In the end we must all remember that we are each a business and this is nothing personal but in business people make decisions quite quickly and usually unemotively. I know many actors don't like that but there you go. All you can do is give yourself as much chance of being noticed and the starting point for many would be the cv, the headshot and the training so if you've only two of the three its best to make them as good and strong as possible. To do otherwise will waste your own time, money and also that of people within the industry.

• 17 years ago
• 29

Thanks for all the feedback.

I have written on my profile, although not on my CV about amateur dramatics…..I guess I should take that off then. Also when I've applied for jobs I have mentioned it on my covering letter. I have had auditions - but maybe I'd have had some more if I didn't mention it so will no longer include that in my covering letter. I have also changed my website. So thanks for all your views.

• 17 years ago
• 30